Kane County residents decry mountain biking

[Ballickarkingofthefairies]

If you google "Forlandssake fabyan forest" this comes up right under their site. YAY!

[Hand/of/Midas]

Batavia has a group called the "batavia bicycle commission" that is active in the city for bike advocacy, they are good people, we should see if they are proactive with this or if there is a way to team up.

http://www.cityofbatavia.net/Content/templates/?a=2763

Working with them would add a lot of credibility as they are residents of the community.

[Red Snail Racing]

Batavia has a group called the "batavia bicycle commission" that is active in the city for bike advocacy, they are good people, we should see if they are proactive with this or if there is a way to team up.

http://www.cityofbatavia.net/Content/templates/?a=2763

Working with them would add a lot of credibility as they are residents of the community.

Thanks for the research.  In this case we are already talking with them, but don't stop looking for allies, we need all we can get.

[longhairmike]

"Forest Preserve District President John Hoscheit"

i'm probably not the first to see his last name and say horseshit

[lownote]

I've been looking at both sides of the argument. I'm reading The Personal MBA by Josh Kaufman, and on page 117, he states: "In every negotiation, the power lies with the party that is able and willing to walk away from a bad deal." This is also reflected in Donald Trump's Art of the Deal in Chapter 2, where he states: "I always go into the deal anticipating the worst. If you plan for the worst --- if you can live with the worst --- the good will always take care of itself." Like or despise The Donald, he's one of the greatest persuaders in modern times.

From the MBr's perspective, it's critical that we frame this debate / deal (it is a deal, right?) in a way where we have the most to walk away from. What do we have to fall back on should the deal go sour? We already have fantastic trails at Palos, SWK, and elsewhere that we can fall back on and continue to fall back on. What do we have to give? Via the rebuttal already linked on this thread:

"When someone backs into the parking spot, do you know what that means?  The mountain bikers do.  Do you know that a teenager without a bike helmet is liable to kill himself against a tree?  Mountain bikers do.  And they are not afraid to say anything, to perverts or to teenagers.  Mountain bikers, moreover, tend to be imposing fellows.  The teenager will go home. So will the pervert.  Having responsible, observant adults (many mountain bikers) recreating in the woods is a good thing when it comes to keeping out the riffraff the locals are so worried about.  I picture the dog walkers running away or turning their heads if the come upon anything untoward, and just being completely oblivious to someone doing something dangerous or destructive."

What do they have to fall back on should the deal go sour? The above quote also shows what they have to fall back on. Which downside would you rather take, great forest preserves elsewhere or the possibility of riff raff in your local woods?

Now what do they have to give? Preservation of valuable forests is what they have to give, a very noble cause and totally understandable to MBr's. This is a common ground which we must demonstrate. We must convincingly demonstrate not only how we can preserve forests and keep unwanted activity out, but how not doing so accomplishes the exact opposite on its own.

Hopefully I'm framing this in a way which shows us in a win-win situation. Our downsides are protected either way. They're going to have to perform a serious risk-benefit analysis and decide if they can live with their downsides. We're offering something we feel is valuable the citizens of Kane County, something to give them to help them further their cause. Ultimately, it's their choice whether they want it or not.

There are multiple ways to approach advocacy, but in this context, I believe allowing ourselves the power and ability to walk away from a bad deal would allow ourselves quite a bit of negotiating power. Of course, it's a group effort, and it's up to our leaders to decide how to effectively approach negotiations.

[Red Snail Racing]

lownote,
That is a well thought out strategy and one that we follow.  There have been many deals in that we have walked away from because they put to much risk on CAMBr or had unreasonable attachments.  In most of those instances it was not that we didn't have an excellent argument for developing a recreational trail system, but rather we ran into people who are irrationally against any type of development or against MTBing.  In those situations we take the high ground and move on, rather than make a bad deal for CAMBr.  Unfortunately, when that happens, many times, the silent majority is deprived of an opportunity to enjoy the outdoors and a few (very few) people get a wooded area with no conservation plan, no recreation plan and a situation where the side of society that requires seclusion for its activities has a place to carry out their illegal activities.

Then there are the times we meet with reasonable people with reasonable concerns and find a middle ground.  In those cases it is a win for everyone, except the nefarious users of the land.  Right now we are working through two agreement, Raceway and Andres Park. Both had good public debate and both look as though we will get a green light to build recreational trail systems for the residents of those areas. CAMBr's involvement will help the woods by removing invasive plants in the trail corridor and allow the police to secure the area.

Advocacy is the most difficult part of building a trail system.  In the mean time we need to continue to help the general public understand who we are and what we stand for, and how we can help them develop recreational sites, with very little cost to their government's stretched budgets.

[Seanbikes]

This was part of the pitch when the West Chapter was working to make the garden a legit location that wouldn't have to fear the middle of the night bulldozers.  There will always be some garbage to clean up but I haven't seen any dirty needles or scary people setting up their camp site since CAMBr had the opportunity to adopt the location. 

[jfaust97]

Maybe we can get a few members of the Oswegoland Park District to go and speak on our behalf at the next Fox Valley Park District meeting? Maybe a few residents from Sundown Lane saying how nice it is that MTBers visit SWK so often because of the MTBers they see less high school kids out there partying and raising hell? I bet we could even find a few equestrians to speak about the incredible trail improvements CAMBR has made and all of the erosion control efforts that have been implemented with minimal cost to the city or park district. Hikers, equestrians and cyclists alike have all benefited from the actions of one well organized group. Case studies in similar "government projects" would likely go a long way in battling the close-mindedness on this issue!!

[Ballickarkingofthefairies]

Unfortunately MTBing has been taken off the table for quite some time on this one.

[BMX Crisis]

I attempted to put a respectful pro-mountain bike comment on their thread and they appear to exclude anything "Pro mountain bike"

[rallymaniac]

screw them. We have two awesome initiatives going on at Raceway Woods and Andres Park.

[lml427]

This Friday (9/28) the IMBA Trail Care Crew is visiting CAMBr.  Included in this visit is a Land Managers seminar. We have reservations from most of the areas counties including, Cook, Du Page, Kane, Kendall, Lake, McHenry(?), Village of Carpentersville and Will, along with other interested parties including a representative from Governor Quinn's office.  CAMBr leadership has put a great deal of effort into building relationships.  Many of the counties are now inquiring about building multi-use natural surface trails.  What we need to do is to continue to build our membership, continue the proper process in obtaining new areas for trails and educate members on how to build and maintain these trails.  If you are a CAMBr member, great, if you know someone who rides, uses the forum and is not yet a member, please encourage them to join.  Want to learn more about trail building and why things are done a certain way?  Come to the IMBA Trail Building School this Saturday (9/29) 9:00am 1075 Tamarac Lane Carpentersville, IL.


http://cambr.org/SMF/index.php?topic=24034.0

[BMX Crisis]

Here is the reply from the ForLandsSake.org web site

Thank you for supporting our cause as we work to save the Fabyan Forest Preserve! PLEASE NOTE: Your comment will be reviewed by a real person before we post it to the website, so there may be a delay before you see it on ForLandsSake.org. Thanks again!

[Ballickarkingofthefairies]

Just thought I would share something interesting happening out at Faybyan, since the MTBers have been kicked out due to us being so destructive to the flora and fauna the forest preserve has bulldozed an 8' wide path through the woods... but I'm sure they didn't hurt any of the ancient oaks.

   I feel like the Indian looking at the highway.

[I pick bad lines]